On being competitive

twill59 Said: Then the internet just brought in a sense of disconnect.

Yep. Thats it, in a nutshell.Disconnect. AL. BBB. Home Advisor (people sometimes think that THEY ARE the contractor!)

That is so true. I signed up with service magic/home advisor for a couple of months about 4 years ago. They sent me dozens of leads for roof repairs. The problem was they sent those same leads to several other roofers. It was first come first serve wins. Most of those "repairs" really needed new roofs that insurance would probably pay. Some had nothing to do with the roof. I tried to develop a rapport with the property owners for future work, but they only saw me as "some guy from service magic". Only a couple of those leads ever turned into work for me. The worst part was people who were looking specifically for me on the internet and knew nothing of service magic, were directed to service magic.

I guess those marketing people really know their stuff. I hear a lot of "branding" going around. HA!

"And the type of houses they are building- it is either a McMansion that is so complicated they can't pay me enough to do, or on the other end of the scale- the "affordable housing" that is so cheap I don't care to do."

Exactly. What surprises me about the McMansion owners is that many times they are aware that their house was built with sub-par standards. Then they nickel and dime the roofers.

"The worst part was people who were looking specifically for me on the internet and knew nothing of service magic, were directed to service magic."

I'd never thought about that possibility. That's tough.

TomB Said: I suppose Im just getting lazy, but its tiring always having to sell yourself.

Interesting... that's what I enjoy most about it, in my 30th year in the biz.

Had a guy that I educated and did a roof for 7 years ago. Big property manager for some high-equity families. Out of the blue he calls this year and says "ya know that roof you did 7 years ago still looks great, and all the other things you told me are starting to show up in some other properties. I'd like you come down and quote some work for me." He's 2 hours away.

After several tit-for-tat go arounds on the quote, and me standing my ground on the original price, only offering him some price breaks by lowering the specification, he goes with the original proposal, for which all the reasons for doing it were well documented.

As we are saying "good bye" he says, "And I just wanted to remind you that I'm paying you $9,401.00 more dollars than the competition" (it's a $58,000 job), and without a moments hesitation I said back to him, "And I just want to remind you that we are worth every penny, and I think I know you well enough to say that if you didn't already know that, we wouldn't have the job".

Long (at least it seemed loooong) period of silence, long enough for me to start to think "oh crap..." when he bursts into uproarious laughter, 10-15 seconds worth, the just says "I know you'll do me a good job. I don't want to do this one again."

Had another recent one where after giving the guy a good educational talk, told him it would ballpark around $82,000. He says "Holy crap, I have two bids under $50k"

I said "Well, I'm sure you do, and I could give you that kind of number too if I didn't care about being honest and giving you a good product. Who are they from?"

He tells me, and amazingly, both quotes are from ex-HRI people.

I ask if I can have one with the price blocked out?

He gives me one.

That week, I write my quote for the system he should do, which is a total tear, at least 40 squares of metal deck replacement, 2 layers of ISO in an R-21 configuration and a Fibertite roof. I include 50 squares of deck in my price and give him the unit price deduct if we do not use it all. The price is $81K

Then I proceed to quote exactly what the "competitor" quoted. I was at $48K, with unit prices for tear off, new insul and deck replacement.

Then I deconstruct that proposal, pointing out that you can't replace deck without tearing off the roof. You don't have rotted deck without wet roofs.... and start adding the unit prices back into it.

The "competitions" price, with unit prices added into it ends up being $85,000 with a substandard waterproofing material.

I wrote, "You can buy the other system in the HOPE that it will be cheaper, but the simple fact is that I'm being honest up front about the cost, and someone else is just back-dooring their way into your pocket, or they are not going to do the things that really need to be done, and you'll repeat this whole process much sooner than you want to."

It was a very satisfying call I got a week later.

Yeppers, I love this stuff.

It's trying to beat those other guys to the bottom of the crap pile that I would find horribly tiring, so I avoid it by saying in an email to this customer, "so while I've certainly proven that our price is not only competitive in the market, it's the lowest and best value, which is a rare combination in today's marketplace, however should you decide that the "cheap" system is the way you want to go, I'd like to decline the opportunity right now. That lowest dollar price was provided for your comparison purposes only. We'll wait this one out and do it for you next time."

People say that "residential is different", but I know people that prove otherwise. Like twill said, it's a smaller piece of the market, but focusing on that piece of it will pay off. I do very little government work, and I've found that business owners are very much a reflection of the public in general when it comes to spending money on a roof they can't see. They will replace carpet every 10 years without blinking an eye, and spend twice as much as they would on a roof, but spending money on a roof that will protect that carpet for 30 years.... it's like pulling teeth in the hospital maternity ward. Pretty darn tough to find one to pull.

I would also like to say that being a good businessman, and being a good roofer are not mutually exclusive terms to one another. You can be both. It just sort of depends on how you define "good business man".

Yes Mike, that's about the way it goes.....Doesn't sound all that bad as you put it.

Maybe I should have said; After 30yrs of it, I'm growing tired of untangling all the misinformation the "competitors" spew forth.

Even if they choose to go with another, I feel obligated somehow to make certain the prospective client is as educated as the situation allows me to enlighten him/her. Over the years, there have been several jobs we didn't land, that the owner has called on us for help, to ensure the contractor they hired performed satisfactory.

Generally speaking, Residential & commercial are vastly different, in so many ways. We've always done both. I lump gov't into commercial, & we used to do a lot of gov't.

I suppose a commercial building owner can be somewhat similar to a homeowner, in that they have a direct connection/responsibility to the structure, whereas gov't does not.

The biggest differences with comm vs res is the fact comm. bldg. owners are generally much more savvy so-to-speak, making for a much more professional/factual arrangement than the typical homeowner who is easily swayed by the silver-tongue salesman. Comm. is far - far easier/less-stressful than residential, IMHO.

I would say, a good roofing businessman, is both a good roofer, as well as a good businessman. You must be both, to be a good contractor.

Well said Mike. If you think about it...it's the manufacturers jobs to go after 100% share of the market, not ours B)