CIAK, general insurance question

Well, just returned from a very amicable meeting with the church, Bob P, and myself. After presenting the case described above, with a smooth, consistent and "helpful" delivery, they seemed to understand the different POV. I called my Cinci adjuster on speaker phone, and asked her "waddawedoo". She said that both parties should submit a claim and that she would be in touch with the aduster from the church's carrier, and they would straighten it out between themselves.

I've been with Cinci for over 20 years. Our relationship is very good. Twice I have taken seriously competitive bids, and told them I was doing it. Once was just this past month. We got a real good quote from an agent representing Motorist Insurance. My GM and I talked after reviewing his proposal, talked all the pro's and con's, then we placed a value on our current relationship and the ease of working with both Cinci and our agent who also does a great job.

When our current agent came over, I took our policy book, turned to the back page, and wrote down a number, not allowing him to see it. I said "Kyle, I just wrote down the number that you need to hit. I am writing it ahead of time, so that you don't think I'm jerking your chain either way. This number is a certain percentage above a proposale received from XXX agency and Motorist Ins. that represents what we feel is a fair value for our relationship and the quality of response we have always had from Cinci.

He went through his proposal, we got to the last page, I saw his number, reached across the table and said "Congratulations" as i opened the book with my hand written number. He beat it by $1,005.00

When we were done, he was happy, I was happy, the competing agency may not have been happy, but he was treated fairly and I think will gladly quote us again.

Relationships go a long way with me. I think this is going to turn out just fine. I appreciate all the comments, and it looks like Ed just nailed it. Although I have no problem turning in a legitimate claim to insurance. Over the last 20 years, I've been a very profitable account for Cinci.>>>

Yeah Mike I thought ed was brilliant maybe he had a Guiness . egg had some great points. cool. I am one who prefers relationship. I'm not always as good at it as I think I could be.

>>>

It wasn't brilliance roaming the room, but a poor past experience on my part, where had I been advised in a timely manner, I would not have paid out of pocket $18,500.00 for a failed American Cemwood Roof Product back in or around 1993.

I learned several years later and in addition to the 18.5 K for material reimbursement, along with about $15,000.00 in legal fees out of pocket, that I did not have to encumber myself with any of those fees.

But, alas, when I was fully aware of my insurance companies duties and obligations, the time had expired for what they deemed to be a Timely Notification of the claim.

Surely I could have forged ahead, and possibly even gotten them to handle the claim, post mortem, but at what additional mental and financial costs.

So, it was a very valuable lesson learned, which I can say, I am glad to be able to pass on to others for their own good usage.

Ed>>>

That is one of the things I have learned to like about you Ed your humble.That being said,......... here it comes. Maybe my unsocial relationship side raiseing it ugly shrouded head. It amazes me that all that money is left on the table when it could be had. I think it was Randy who is doing the same thing / I scratch my head in disbelief . My question WHY ??????>>>

Not unsocial at all.....

By the time I was made aware of the potential for the liability coverage being afforded to me, it was deemed an untimely claim and I would have once again had to incur great expense fighting with what was expected to be minimal chances of winning.

Here is something else that occurred. When finding yourself in a situation that your standard attorney can not handle, due to experience or location and a lack of desire to travel to the Downtown Chicago Court venue from our distant suburbs in the NW side, you must rely on a referral.

All of these referred attorneys sound fantastic when they are seeking their retainer, but as soon as the case becomes challenging, they request that you accept some undesirable plead outcome.

Now, do you continue with someone who wants out of your case, even though they are bound ethically to forge ahead?

To expedite you making a decision to either seek other counsel or accept a plead agreement, they decide to request substantial additional fees not previously discussed.

Now, go to attorney #2 and attorney #3, until you get tired of restarting the case without any sign of acceptable conclusions ahead.

One attorney even screwed up by missing a court appearance, which allowed the other party to enter a judgment against my company for $45,000.00.

Had my Bank President not notified me of what was going to occur at the close of business that day, all funds in my accounts would have disappeared.

I was able to get that judgment quashed, but in the mean time, I just wanted the case to be done and over, even with the payments that I had to make.

How many people know that their liability policy covers material defects and the associated fees to make the customer whole?

What was incredulous about that occasion to install the American Cemwood product, was that the home owner himself brought that product to the table, after seeing it at a home show, which we then pursued and got certified to install. The manufacturers rep was on hand throughout the entire installation, approving every detail we did.

Ed>>>

One of the best posts on the site. I thought it would end with you and ur insurance fighting it out. You should not feel bad about filing a valid claim. They dont feel bad about sending ur bill out. Good to hear its off ur shoulders.>>>

At the end of our work day, we loaded ladders, tools, etc. into the truck and came home. The roof was accessed by means unknown to us, but it was not by our equipment. All of the various roof areas were all damaged. Some roofs were complete, some not.

The owner thinks we need to pay for the damages, and wants a new roof installed.

That seems to sum it up as far as I can see, if you or your equipment was not facilitated during the dastardly act then one would have to assume it was of no consequence whether you were doing their roof or not, or even working on a project at the site. So I don't see how you or your company even figures into the equation.........>>>

I can tell you how the customer's insurance carrier is going to "see it". How many times have you ever heard of a new roof being "vandalized". In my 40 some years in construction, 23 in roofing, I've NEVER heard of it. I have heard of stealing equipment off a roof, like a generator or something, but just "vandalism"? Please........this had to be something personal and that's how their insurance company will look at it. I hope Mike has good insurance because he'll probably get the blame here, deserved or not. My experience with insurance carriers has not been that good but one of my friends here in Orlando has had great luck getting them to fix problem jobs. Hope it works out for 'ya Mike.......keep us posted.

JET>>>

It sounds like either way, it's insurable loss. That takes some of the sting out.

It seems to me that whoever suffered the loss is the party whose insurance will have to pay. When do the materials become the property owners? When they are delivered to the job? After they are installed? After final inspection? After the roof is paid for?>>>

2 of my guys met with the church and their insurance adjuster. Looks like everything will be taken care of on their end.

don't know why, but I never seem to have the same experiences as Jet.

As soon as the carrier was informed of the facts, they stepped right up to the plate. As suspected, the guy we are having to deal with at the church NEVER contacted the insurance company.>>>

When you go back to repair or reroof, it might not hurt to have night security while the work is being done.>>>

Mike H Said: 2 of my guys met with the church and their insurance adjuster. Looks like everything will be taken care of on their end.

dont know why, but I never seem to have the same experiences as Jet.

As soon as the carrier was informed of the facts, they stepped right up to the plate. As suspected, the guy we are having to deal with at the church NEVER contacted the insurance company.

You haven't been around long enough Mike ;) ;) Give it a couple decades and you'll experience things you've never dreamed of. Glad to hear their insurance company is at least aware (of the issue) now, let us know if they actually "step up". Any idea on who did this to you?

JET>>>

Come on Jet, I already got 27 years of roofing under my belt. I wanna be retired before another couple decades goes by. LOL

From my understanding, it's done deal. They have agreed to responsibility. Maybe they will try to knock the price down a little, but that hasn't happened yet. No, we don't have written approval yet either, but if what was said in the meeting was true, that's just a matter of waiting on the paperwork flow.

Who did it? We can't prove it, but we "know" it was union related. They knew what they were doing.>>>

C'mon Mike, how old are you now? You gotta start "experience" when you're at least 20 years old and I know you're not 47 yet :P :P Just bustin' balls.........hope it works out for you but I don't think their carrier will pick up the tab on this one. Knowing how insurance carriers work they'll make your carrier pay (and they should in this case) and then force a subrogation hearing to get their money back. Being from the Chicago area I know how unions can make your life miserable and have gone toe to toe with them on more than one occasion. You might want to meet with the union boss and get a deal worked out. The last thing you want is for them to follow you around. Good luck.........

JET>>>

Started roofing at 16, 43 now. I started my first company when I was 19. Of course I've been around it all my life, and we were in the union back when I was a kid. We had a lot of problems when we dropped out, and I'm not gonna work any deals with them.

Of course I've been around it all my life, and I can't recall dad ever having the problems you describe either.

We'll see what happens. thanks.>>>